RSVP Blog

Hear, hear MT, Hi ya Saintly- hi to all and welcome.

Sincere Canada it hurts hey...but you just keep moving forward. learn from the past, win the lesson and always smile on the inside hun.

xxxxx

Bliss kiss waves hello to ya all.

Peace out xxxxxxxxxx

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 31, 2008 2:25 PM

In short, No, I tell them right off the bat. When you are a full time parent with out weekends off what option do you have.
There is not right or wrong here, it comes down to the individual and their circumstances the mother of my son had a child & I didn't find out until well into the courtship, by that time I had feelings for the her...

Posted by: sincerelyseeking at August 30, 2008 9:59 PM

Saintly: hello

I don't know who you have been speaking to re: vaccination,but I agree with the comments for it,below.

Although i believe that some Doctors are not completely ethical due to my own experience,I believe that Vaccination is extremely important.

In addition, i believe drinking tap water is too! I was married to a Dentist once)and a very good one) and watched him for years making dentures for people....how awful not to be able to properly taste your food.

Mind you,it won't help gum disease.

Marcus.......you have a hearing problem? Sorry mate,i have to have a little chuckle!!!

ji66........hello!

Where do i find the time? I don't have time,but it becomes a bit addictive.....housework is left undone,but that's OK as it is a "neverendingstory"....

I think you have the right idea for you as far as talking about children is concerned.Personally i keep them out of the equation meaning I may talk about them but don't involve them with my partner.

Wow it's late....

Posted by: musicteacher at August 28, 2008 2:14 AM

Where do I start! I am new at this blogging so my apologies to all the frequent bloggers out there, I want to know where you find the time to chat about all the different issues raised?. In regards to telling a date if you have children or not, as a sole parent I would say I had two children but not go into too much detail, I also want to be seen just for me without the Mum tag,

Posted by: jl66 at August 26, 2008 5:32 PM

Oh I agree thelynathdairy, but the powers that be keep editing so I gave up.

wonder how often that happens?

Posted by: saintly08 at August 25, 2008 7:25 AM

Saintly , Marcus always has something to say that's true...and isn't it great? He has provided many hours of amusement and discussion here .sometimes infuriating, sometimes funny ,usually thought provoking and definitely challenging.

I do wonder though about people who come into the blog and make a statement about an issue, say nothing to back or explain their point of view and then try to dismiss anyone else who does have something to contribute as unworthwhile.

Posted by: thelynathdiary at August 24, 2008 10:35 PM

OH I get it now

How thick of me

Marcus is the guy, every room has one, You all know, that guy who wants to sit there and pick an argument with anyone about anything for his own ammusement.

Oh, slow moment from me.

moving on............

Posted by: saintly08 at August 24, 2008 4:39 PM

Show me your medical degree marcus and I'll think you have something worthwhile to say on this subject.

Hay amourmoi... xxxxxx

Posted by: saintly08 at August 24, 2008 4:32 PM

The last couple of comments sum it up pretty well. In the vast majority of cases, modern vaccines do what they are intended to do with little or no side effects. It all comes down to risk and trust.

Is the risk of not having a particular vaccination far greater than having it? If so, the logical choice would be to have the vaccination.

There is a mountain of information available on the 'Net we can use to research a particular vaccine, so that we can exercise a choice from an informed position rather than obscure hearsay.

We live in communities, so what happens to us can have widespread effect on many others. While it may seem that our 'rights' to choice are overridden by bureaucrats, there's usually a sound reason for doing so, based on decades of scientific research and evidence. It may not be bullet-proof - sometimes they do it get wrong. But as far as the major diseases go, what is available these days is tried and tested.

I personally would want my children vaccinated - I'm not prepared to go against overwhelming evidence to take the risk of leaving my child exposed to a horrible and preventable death. Sure, my child would probably not develop such a disease, but they would be totally unprotected and contact with anyone that is carrying such a disease would place my child in a position of being odds-on to contract that disease, usually with crippling or fatal consequences. I owe it to my children, and the children of others to take one less risk out of their curly path that we call 'life'...

Posted by: heart2heart57 at August 24, 2008 10:39 AM

As a mother of two very healthy and well balanced kids (both take after thier mother of course xx)

I can say that I weighed the risk considerable before vaccination and the same can be said for my dog.

However I took the risk and both boys came away unscathed.

I also know another mother who thinks the same as me (mostly all mothers think the same when dealing with thier precious cargo) and took the risk and sadly did fall into the small % that are affected and even more sadly cries for a child that will never walk or talk.

While we both adore our offspring and the each shine in thier own way it is always a sad day, always a tear to help wipe of her face, always a hand to hold when she breaks down and cries for the future of the child she wanted and planned much for xxxxxxx going to get a tissue and have a little cry myself now.

PS Morning to you all xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 24, 2008 9:17 AM

Belladonna you cannot be come immune to some bacteria's until you have been exposed to them The vaccination gives a small dose which causes the body to fight it and then create immunity in the event of another exposure.

Fluoridation is another matter as dental decay is not usually life threatening...but have you noticed how many people on RSVP still ask "Have you got your own teeth" Fluoridation good for dating.....

Indivdual choice over the what is best for the group is a modern idea in a spoilt society.

Apart from the risk of death or permanent disability from contracting these diseases in childhood there is also the risk to unborn developing babies and the legacy of damage which can show up in adulthood.

I would rather take the small risk by immunising than a greater risk with my childs life or permanent disability.

Posted by: thelynathdiary at August 23, 2008 10:11 PM

What the?? If our bodies worked that well, belladonnajade, vaccines would never need to be introduced!
To vaccinate our children against potentially deadly disease is our responsibility, surely.
l wonder if the people in the past cursed their immune system as they were dying or suffering from deadly disease that would still be around rampantly today if not for vaccines to stamp them out!..................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 23, 2008 9:46 PM

Posted by: belladonnajade at August 23, 2008 7:55 PM - Therein lies the problem with those diseases I mentioned (and there's many many more). The general immune system is powerless against them. All but a few percent of the un-vaccinated population would be infected should an outbreak occur. One the most insidious aspects of a lot of these diseases is that they incubate long before symptoms develop - once you know you have got such a disease, it's often too late to treat. To make matters even worse, by the time you know you have one, you've infected many others as well.

I'm glad I had my Polio, Tetanus, and TB shots as a kid, and Smallpox when I went overseas. Having known people that contracted Polio and survived, it is one of the most evil diseases going. And having had the opportunity of seeing a few other countries in this world, I am so glad that I did not succumb to any anything I was guarded against - you'd be lucky to find an Aspro in those countries - much less something that would stall a catastrophe, or indeed provide respite should one become stricken.

Posted by: heart2heart57 at August 23, 2008 8:35 PM

heart2heart57 at August 23, 2008 7:37 PM
I think the information that succesive governments of all persuasions use when establishing health policy is taken from experts. Immunology and vaccination research results papers and the medical information that government agencies use to make decisions is readily available: we certainly are not being fed a Government line.
For various reasons people are able to exempt themselves from civic resposibilities (I was excused from jury duty recently because of my hearing). Faith is one reason various religions won't allow blood transfusions say. The child who dies because his Seventh Day Adventist parents wont allow a transfusion in my mind are criminally culpable; in the same way that refusing to provide asistance when you can to an injured person is morally and legally wrong. Parents not allowing, or actively preventing a potential lifesaving vaccination have come to a point where our social responsibilities for a child unable to decide and parents making patently bad decisions, means that some liberties need to be over ridden and decisions made for the greater good. Below is a lift from an Age article concerning a Sydney couple and their kid.

One of the doctors who alerted state authorities to the couple's refusal to have the baby vaccinated said the child's rights were being ignored.

"I am a strong believer in vaccinations being voluntary but not getting this baby vaccinated is a form of child abuse," said David Isaacs, a professor in paediatric infectious diseases.

"We are talking a potentially major and awful outcome for this child and it is our job to protect children when they can't make decisions for themselves," the Herald quoted him as saying.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 23, 2008 8:10 PM

I think people should have the choice about what goes in to their body, including fluoride, and vaccinations. Our bodies are fitted out with a defence against disease, our immune systems, if your body is healthy it will work properly, we need to be much more careful about what is going in to our bodies before immune systems will be working properly again though!

Posted by: belladonnajade at August 23, 2008 7:55 PM

I can see both sides to the vaccination dilema. Do we take what the Govt of the day feeds us as gospel, or do we go with our gut? While water fluoridation might be saving out teeth, is there a long-term side-effect to our bones through calcium-leaching? Even the midico's can't agree on this - it's a wait-and-see-approach. It will all come out in the wash in a generation or two - bad luck if they got it wrong.

But things like polio? TB? Rubella? Smallpox/Plague? Arhaeic diseases that sould no longer exist. Diseases that have a fairly well proven track record that the risks of *not* being vaccinated seem to far outweigh the risks of being vaccinated.

I guess it's the individuals choice and right to decide not to have their children vaccinated against certain conditions. But at what cost? The problem with certain diseases is that they do not confine themselves to the indivudual, and they do not discriminate. If ONE person develops Polio, TB, Smallpox etc, the entire population is put at risk. And the first to be affected will be those that have not been vaccinated.

I guess the question is, is that a risk worth taking? Statistically, it's pretty much a death-sentence if an un-vaccinated person is exposed to certain viscous diseases. While we can excercise choice, do we have a moral responsiblity to the community in general? Which risk is greater? The chance of a side effect, or the chance of incubating something that should no longer be present in our modern day?

I'm open to suggestion here...

Posted by: heart2heart57 at August 23, 2008 7:37 PM

saintly08 August 23, 2008 11:26 AM
you are not 'doing the right thing'.
You are poorly informed and what you are saying goes against the advice that every health department in the country issues. Promoting the sort of unfounded scepticism is bloody irresponsible
Australia doesn't have the second highest life expectancy and low infant mortality (despite the deplorable situation for aboriginals) because of a third world witch doctor type approach

There was an article in the Australian this morning about the NSW Health Department taking out a court order to compel a couple to have their kid vaccinated against HepB. That is how seriously they take it.

Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 23, 2008 4:18 PM

Marcus, I dont agree with you and after talking to educated health professionals, I am doing the right thing.

Posted by: saintly08 at August 23, 2008 11:26 AM

I remember when my kids were vaccinated as babies, there was no questioning it you just did it.
The risk involved, not that l recall being told them, would certainly not have swayed my judgement about having them done.
I have a vague recollecton of my brother having mumps when l was a girl, and l do remember pretending to have them so l could get off school. This would have been around 1967 ish.......
Anyone who has seen vision of a polio affected person would think that it was a disease from the middle ages and not one from last century, such a cruel outcome to have to live in an iron lung.....

I wish there were a vaccine for the common cold! Whilst not life threatening it sure is a pain in the bum!....................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 23, 2008 11:22 AM

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 22, 2008 4:00 PM - Ahhhh... GEMINII - two people for the price of one. What more could you ask for...? ~*WG*~

Posted by: heart2heart57 at August 22, 2008 11:57 PM

Doctors do not blindly vaccines.
There is all the more reason that small babies should be immunised. If a child has an accute illness then the immunisation can be delayed.

Why put children at risk of death from now controlled disease- especially when anitbiotics are becoming less effective against bacteria.?

Posted by: thelynathdiary at August 22, 2008 10:28 PM

saintly08 at August 22, 2008 11:41 AM
I've read your last couple of postings here with interest. You have made it quite clear that you are aware of a number of environmental and genetic risk factors that may be involved in childrens ill health. Faith in your case was obviously no protection from them.
Fortunately for your youngsters I gather they have been immunised against various diseases. Regardless of whatever bad information you have been given, immunisation programs have been extremely successful. The idea that vaccines, particularly MMR are associated with autism or diabetes has been proposed, carefully examined and comprehensively rejected. Vaccines are commonly administered around the time Autism is diagnosed but do not cause it. There is no evidence either that there is a connection with SIDS.
The problem with not immunising is that the risk of complication or death from disease is hugely higher than any issues that may arise. The other thing is that irresponsible non vaccination will allow a disease outbreak to take hold and cause far more damage.
Your ignorance and stubborness on this mimics what has happened in parts of Muslim Africa. Vaccinations were being comprehensively rejected on a village or region basis because the rumour was that it was a Christian sterilisation plot.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 22, 2008 10:20 PM

amour08xx

oh that is the funniest.... but ever so true, but I would never write that about myself, I'm not THAT outgoing.

I'll be joinin the other communities tonite when said kids are sleeping.

the best laugh I've had in ages............

Posted by: saintly08 at August 22, 2008 4:59 PM

Saintly it is moi your friend again amour08xx

Now the reason we all type to you on this page is because we all have grown a connection with you and we are mostly parents on this page.

Having said that I have re visited your profile so please forgive me pushing your aura open further.

You will need to join other communties to find other like minded ppl.

On the other pages you should try to put out what you want to get back from your admiration of fans soon.

Think what you like to do when (I know not always possible but please try) when the children may be overnight in the care of a trusted soul.

Then get cracking and join the dating life, mining men, food and wine lovers pages as well.

I am going to start you off to remind you of the femme fatale that you have been holding for too long so here it goes as a start on the dating page: this is how you should appear to the one you want.
xxxxxxxGL xxxx
peace out xxxxxxxxxx

GEMINI - Irresistible
Nice. Love is one of a kind. Great listeners. Very good in the 'you know where'. Lover not a fighter, but will still knock you out. Trustworthy. Always happy. Loud. Talkative. Outgoing. VERY FORGIVING. Loves to make out. Has a beautiful smile. Generous. Strong; THE MOST IRRESISTIBLE

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 22, 2008 4:00 PM

Knowing now what I know. I never would have let any of my children been immunised. It is one of my passions that I think not enough parents are educated enough about. An underweight child, a small baby, a sick child... Never should be immunised. But the doctors blindly give them anyway. The blanket policy of one size fits all dosent work with these small presious creatures, yet we (modern humans) keep on sticking that stuff into our offspring. It makes me cry thinking of it and our childrens futures.

It is a genetic predisposition amourmoi and sadly we dont know until its too late.

Hi Ronda, my littlies dont like music or much noise, so no havent tried music therapy, its something I think will be down the track. I'm just starting ABA (google it for an explination if your interested) for my littlies Autism.

Do blogs always go so off topic?

Posted by: saintly08 at August 22, 2008 11:41 AM

Saintly.............I don't know how you do it,but you do.I take off my beret to you.

Your new name is great...although you should consider "Wonderwoman"(or has that been taken too?

Have you tried any music therapy with the children?

Regards,
Rodna

Posted by: musicteacher at August 22, 2008 11:11 AM

OML: I just found a posting close to my heart and I shall not say names as I am not into attacking personal values as they are as individual as the good company I find myself here on this page with xx

However there are many reasons why modern medicines work for some and not for others.

Given how many young lives were lost in thier prime I am a very strong advocate for all things incubated and let them stay at the bottom of the river along with the deceased, tissues, plague and rats...

Not all can have modern medicine and that is not a personal choice rather thier genetic predispostion.

So take what ever works for you and hits the magic spot where it needs to go (and no I am not speaking of illicit drugs just incase someone goes down that road by accident ((###STOP****HERE^^^PLS) xxxxx peace out xx

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 22, 2008 8:16 AM

iaminperth, there are Government funded respite programs for at home or residential respite for children with disabilities.
Saintly I hope you are tied into them.If not then contact The Commonwealth Carer Respite Centre ccrcbs.org.au and they can help you.
Unless there is a very good reason to do so Immunisations should not be stopped.

Posted by: thelynathdiary at August 21, 2008 11:37 PM

Saintly08, well done on both the name change and your amazing courage and grace.........

I would imagine that 5 children would be a handful, and l hope that the man of your dreams arrives soon.......................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 21, 2008 10:30 PM

Aligning with religious hocus pocus???

I'm a person with great Faith Marcus, hocus pocus or not, it does wonders for the soul, maybe you should try it.

Posted by: saintly08 at August 21, 2008 5:42 PM

I am wearing my stack hat and other protective gear Marcus if you want to have a better go than that.......peace out xxxxx

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 21, 2008 4:20 PM

Posted by: amoral at August 20, 2008 11:25 PM

"What about something like saintly08?
xxxx"

Not sure aligning emptyalone with the religious hocus pocus is helpful although I can imagine day to day being a miracle worker would come in handy for her.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 21, 2008 3:32 PM

Saintly08 you are a living legend..xxxx peace out and enjoy yourself.

Why?

To steel a very good line from the marketing tools that be>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because your worth it.xx

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 21, 2008 10:06 AM

Just for future reference

emptyalone = saintly08

didnt realize that the last post would have the old profile attached to it

Posted by: saintly08 at August 21, 2008 9:13 AM

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 20, 2008 11:25 PM

What about something like saintly08?
xxxx

Gee that was easy, didnt think we were allowed to change our names.. LOL

Posted by: emptyalone at August 21, 2008 8:30 AM

Morning bloggers

When I signed up it was just how I felt. And all the good names were taken!!!

iaminperth - yes more and more kids all the time are getting this Autism / ADHD / Aspergers tags. I think its a mix, environment, our foods, immunisations, all part of a huge puzzle piece that makes these conditions. And genetics. My parents grew up on sugar cane farms, heavy poisons were around them and their foods, they had me, when my mother was pregnant with me she was aerial sprayed with agent orange, (it was the norm to spray the crops with that back then), and we grew our own foods when I was a child. Then now, I have kids and the chain of poisions and stuff just keep coming down through the bodies to my kids.

How can kids NOT have something wrong with them?

Just think of the Autism Awareness Ribbon. Its a jigsaw puzzle. Each little bit of that jigsaw made the child, and to unwrap the condition you need to find exact what each little puzzle piece is.

Posted by: emptyalone at August 21, 2008 8:27 AM

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 20, 2008 9:17 PM

Estrogen supplement? Marcus, if a supplement would suppress hairs growing in places I wish they would not grow I would happily take it irrespective whether it was officially approved by Waterbombe or not.
rgds grego

Posted by: grego7 at August 20, 2008 11:39 PM

E&A, I read your profile as well and you say you can't give 100% of your time to a man.....well guess what neither can I......nor do I want to and probably a lot of others on this site. That is not necessarily a bad thing, the committment is 100% but the timing may be a bit off at times because of other projects. I think any adult who expects 100% of the time from another adult would be a little too juvenille for me as I need my space and also it's so lovely to be able to talk about and share experiences with someone you are in tune with in the quiet times. You are who you are, don't apologise for it, that's what makes you unique.

Posted by: iaminperth at August 20, 2008 11:27 PM

e&a love your post hun but for a person that is well and does not have your in deepth knowledge it looks like this.....

ICU waiting at the E&A to see ENTS.....for a guy (not that I am one although I am sure the wild will ride this to town and back) it would be hard to connect?

What about something like saintly08?
xxxx

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 20, 2008 11:25 PM

Perth, you got it in one about Emptyalone. She is a person of massive courage and character. And of graciousness in her reaction to Marcus.
rgds grego

Posted by: grego7 at August 20, 2008 11:11 PM

emptyalone ~ I tend to agree with Perth re your profile name. It does read to me as maybe vunerable and perhaps needy. And I don't read you as a person like that at all.

Hope you find that magical connection with someone. You sure are entitled.

Jen

Posted by: jenniferhi at August 20, 2008 10:55 PM

Hi Empty and Alone, Are more children being diagnosed these days because there are more children suffering these types of problems or is it that the testing is far more acceptable. The number of children diagnosed with autism seems to be growing by the minute. My neighbour is a teacher and she has a couple in her class at school. They are supposed to have carers but apparently govt. funding fails as usual. May I ask what do you do for leisure for yourself or is that a totally stupid question. I can';t imagine you having any 'me'time at all but surely there must be a little window somewhere. P;S. think up a new name pls because you are certainly not an empty person and you are not alone.

Posted by: iaminperth at August 20, 2008 10:17 PM

Gosh, Marcus, you really do appear to have a problem with me....what is it, are you really secretly attracted to us grannies.... of course you are ... I wonder what it is about me that you like so much... I do have a great-grandma who had seventeen children with (I hope) seventeen men.... she would have been just your sort of chick, wouldn't she? Well there you go, it must be the genes I've inherited that makes me irresistible to you....I tell you what, I put my profile up quite a bit, but you NEVER look....I'm so disappointed....all that effort and I'm invisible to you....oh well, I'll get over it ...* sigh* .

Posted by: waterbombe at August 20, 2008 10:01 PM

emptyalone at August 20, 2008 11:07 AM

"Usually I would ignore things I dont understand, but..."

Babe. If you don't understand something it makes sense to find out about it, not ignore it. That could be particularly applicable to the context of the original question I asked you.
Nothing complicated in my last post; I explained how you were being had a lend of.

Grego, I'm known to be fond of a coffee. You appear to be on a waterflambe approved estrogen supplement.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 20, 2008 9:17 PM

Greg that wasn't incisive enough mate!..................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 20, 2008 7:54 PM

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 20, 2008 1:50 AM

Marcus,
I am with empyalone re your post. What are you on about? Or maybe what are you on?

Where were the incisive and objective male comments on Women's Bizzo?
rgds grego

Posted by: grego7 at August 20, 2008 6:03 PM

laughsandtalks at August 20, 2008 1:50 AM

I like to think being that english is my birth tongue that I can understand it, but Marcus I didnt understand any of that.

Usually I would ignore things I dont understand, but since your refering to me in there I just want to say. Dude speak english please.

Posted by: emptyalone at August 20, 2008 11:07 AM

dragon1978 at August 18, 2008 10:40 PM
I've had a bit to do with kids, and adults with Aspergers. I know one guy, a bit younger than you, who is very bright in his field but unfortunately a social recluse because of his difficulties interacting.
iaminperth at August 18, 2008 9:52 AM
I did ask a relevant question of emptyalone, pooches. Waterbombe fell over herself charging in to answer it for her, and gave the incorrect answer, or answered the incorrect question; not the one the person I asked eventually gave.
She has since been up to her tricks again. She deftly honeytongued emptyalone and cynically manipulated her into reappearing here so she can take a contrived swipe in this direction.
Waterflambe gets angry and frustrated if men dare to comment incisively and objectively on what she regards as her legitimate turf; Women's Bizzo. Perhaps she thinks she has a sole descended proprietorship: after all a grandmother, we are informed, was a fertility Godess and produced 17 offspring, though we are pointedly not told with how many blokes.
Anyway the cowardice and lack of ethics is on display again. No visible profile, no personal or social risk, and attempting to gain kudos and legitimacy here by using visible emptyalone as a stalking horse is just riding. It's bludging on the courage of honest, gutsy, upfront bloggers efforts.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 20, 2008 1:50 AM

im with u emptyalone maybe we do ned to get out there more i was on my own for 2 years after I finally left the boys father. Then kept getting told id never find som1 that would take on my 3 boys. Maybe there right but I can hope not. Iv met som1 it only new 3 weeks now & seems to be going ok but keep getting told he wont stick around cos of the boys. But he tells me I am their mother not him & he wants to be with me for me so Im hoping this is the 1

Posted by: dragon1978 at August 19, 2008 1:03 PM

Hi emptyalone,
Nice to hear from you again!
Yes it didn't surprise me that some people think it's okay to "judge" you, luckily I never had too many problems with my children, except my eldest son was quite a handful. Of course, it was always my parenting ability that was questioned by everyone, including my quite unsupportive ex and his mother, plus the odd psychologist or two!
I came from a background of alcoholism and family violence, so of course it was me!

Finally aged 11, a psychologist realised there was a lot more to it and it was discovered he had a mild, but no less frightening (for him!) form of OCD.
I felt such relief, I had always known things weren't quite right for him, but no one would listen preferring to judge me as an "unfulfilled mother" despite the fact I had three other children who had no problems!

With treatment and counselling he improved rapidly, now leads a normal life and has travelled overseas twice on his own with no problems. Because of that fantastic psychologist he knows exactly what to do when he is getting overwhelmed with life.

I had that with a relatively minor issue (compared to your situation) in my son's life, I can only imagine the cr*p you have to deal with everyday!

Posted by: amberlight58 at August 19, 2008 11:08 AM

Maybe RSVP should have a 'community' for parents with special needs, it affects so many parents these days.

And hell if parents should stay single and away from the world just because they have a child with special needs.

I think in general we are a silent group, not wanting to bring too much attention to ourselves, as previous blog comments show.

Sad to say, its the normal reaction we get sometimes.

Posted by: emptyalone at August 19, 2008 9:05 AM

oh welcome back Emptyalone! And hello to you Dragon, it sounds like you have your hands full too. I agree with you about cars,EA, I dated an RSVP guy who had a BMW, a white one, all I noticed was that it was white. I think I should have noticed that it was a BMW. Cars get you from A to B...that's about it as far as I'm concerned.

Posted by: waterbombe at August 18, 2008 11:15 PM

im a mum of 2 asperges boys & a 3rd not diagnosed but it looks like he will be the same iv not been hear b4 but was reding thru never sawthe coment of cors but ur coment wb & gota say marcus have u met a child like that? they are all different. My littlest is the sweetest child he loves every1 he meets & every1 loves him. I couldnt imagine my life without him people cant judge something they dont know. From experiense of my own at least these children are incredibly intellgent little people that are worth every bit of the love they get from every1 that meets them

Posted by: dragon1978 at August 18, 2008 10:40 PM

Shame WB. E and Alone if you are out there, come back and blog again. We would like to hear how you are and how you are going with your children.

Posted by: iaminperth at August 18, 2008 10:36 PM

Dont you hate that, click the wrong button before you finnished?

I stepped out of the conversation when it hit cars. I'm not a car person. It has 4 wheels and you put petrol here.. thats my technical on them.

And was so keeping away from the gay conversation.

But I'm still here and eager to blog along. :)

Posted by: emptyalone at August 18, 2008 10:04 PM

I'm still very much here. Just been busy.
And I have 5 children, and 4 of them have Autism.
I'm kinda embarrised at what you guys have said about me, I'm sure my ex wouldnt agree.... LOL

Posted by: emptyalone at August 18, 2008 10:02 PM

She may still be reading the blogs, although she doesn't post. But if I came on here for the first time and someone said that sort of thing to me, I would not bother again....why lay yourself open to that sort of comment in your leisure time when you have so much hardship in your daily life? There are nicer places to blog, that's what I'd think.

Posted by: waterbombe at August 18, 2008 8:06 PM

Where has she gone WB. She doesn't post anymore ? or rather how would she find the time to post anything. I honestly don't know how people cope in those types of situations, amazing people. Did she leave the blogs. It's hard to work out what is happening any more as everything is moderated into oblivion. It's more like a school yard these days and unfortunately does nothing for the continuity.

Posted by: iaminperth at August 18, 2008 6:07 PM

Perth, Emptyalone was generous and compassionate and astonishingly lovely before Marcus said that, and she was the same after he said that. Emptyalone already had that strength and compassion, that was obvious .... Marcus did nothing at all to develop it in her. He was more than a clumsy bod, he was downright awful and lots of people told him so. He doesn''t deserve credit in this situation. It's just not logical to say 'without someone nasty around we wouldn't have a chance to show how good we are' (if that is what you are saying...I may have misunderstood you) .

And think of the damage to her...I would have found that comment very hurtful in her situation. That's my main point. I agree with you, she sounds like a 'fabulous courageous lady'.

Posted by: waterbombe at August 18, 2008 5:45 PM

aaah, you mean Harmey Norvan :-)

Posted by: egernia at August 18, 2008 1:00 PM

Posted by: waterbombe at August 18, 2008 9:19 AM

WB, I endorse your comments. I cant say anything else as all my posts on this matter have been moderated out.
rgds grego

Posted by: grego7 at August 18, 2008 12:23 PM

Yes WB, I couldn't find the particular blog. I still think it's pretty good though because Marcus being a bit of a clumsy bod with his terminology really brought out the best in Emptyalone and without that she wouldn't have been able to display such strength and honesty on these blogs. I personally cannot imagine having four children, let alone four challenged ones. She deserves all the help she can get and she sounds like a fabulous courageous lady.

Posted by: iaminperth at August 18, 2008 12:18 PM

Ha, Willow, Hardly Normal, l had to read that twice before l got it!!

The nest still has her 20 year old brother in it, so l'm not out of the woods yet. He is often out, he still needs a few things done, such as reminding him about appointments and suchlike.
Though he is home today with a rotten cold and earache from hell, and have organised his doctor's appointment for this afternoon and made him some breakfast. I don't think it matters how old they are, when they are sick they still look to mum for a bit of sympathy and help...................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 18, 2008 11:47 AM

Kaz, my Mum is also experiencing the empty nest syndrome. The youngest of 8 has just left home and she's beside herself. They are looking to move up here and we went to Hardly Normal to look at stoves. She picked this huge range - 6 burners and room to cook an emu, rather than a xmas turkey. It can be quite difficult adjusting, but at least at 21, your daughter is, I am assuming, fairly independent? My 16 year old brother was spoilt rotten!

Posted by: willow29 at August 18, 2008 11:13 AM

Well, my experience of being a hands on mother is coming to its conclusion inasmuch as having my children living with me.
My eldest (21) has moved out of home over the weekend to set up house with her boyfriend and it has been 21 years of mostly pure delight having her in my care.
Gosh, don't you think to yourself "where did all those years go"?

At least l have made sure she nows how to cook a decent meal. I remember when l first married l couldn't cook anything apart from steak and salad. Had to ring my mum and ask her how to time a roast so that everything was ready at the same time, and once thickened soup with gravy!!!

The worst thing is now l have to think about cooking for just me and my son, l don't know HOW to cook small quantities of anything.
Ah well, such is life..................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 18, 2008 11:03 AM

You are right about the mother, iaminperth, she is called Emptyalone, and she was amazing. However Marcus didn't ask a question, he made a judgement. The judgements was that she had been, and I quote, "extraordinarily irresponsible"in having 4 autistic kids. You may have read the blog after the moderator deleted 24 hours of posts on the topic. A large number of bloggers responded to him and had their posts deleted as well but they can substantiate what he said. It was pretty dreadful and to hear it called gentle beggars belief. I guess it's one of those situations that just demonstrates, for me, why I never went out with childless men after I had an experience with one guy ...the lack of awareness and lack of sensitivity for the attachment you have for your kids really surprised me. But adults who have never had to put someone else first 24/7 for many years have a different slant on life. Some (not all) are still like children themselves, it's still "it's all about me and what i want". You still get that amongst parents, god knows, but you do get it less often, imho. It was a better bet to date men who were fathers, who understood how I felt about my kids, and why I would put them first sometimes.

Posted by: waterbombe at August 18, 2008 10:37 AM

I thought Marcus just asked a question and the mother involved simply answered the question in an extraordinarily sensible down to earth way. I thought it demonstrated the courage, compassion and sensibility this mum has in the raising of her children and was great for us to read.

Posted by: iaminperth at August 18, 2008 9:52 AM

"I related a little of my experience as a step parent to a girl with a rare syndrome while making a gentle point about reproductive social responsibility here earlier". laughsandtalks at August 15, 2008 7:25 PM.

A GENTLE point, Marcus? You told Emptyalone, who has 4 autistic kids, that you could understand her having 1 or 2, but that having 4 autistic children was "extraordinarily irresponsible" of her. That's not gentle, that's cruel. Talk about kicking someone when they are down. Ten people must have told you so immediately, and it was all removed very quickly...with your comment as the cause. And you seem to have a serious case of self-delusion,as well. You continued "My perspective wasn't considered worthy, I was seen as grandstanding, was growled at and and then moderated into oblivion". I think anyone else would understand why that happened...your self-justification and smooth slippage from cruelty to "gentleness" should worry you...something is wrong in your ethical system, Marcus.

But just to take your own tack, can I say how relieved I am that you have shown sufficient reproductive responsibility yourself not to breed? By remaining childless, and not passing on your genes or values, you have saved the rest of us from more of you. And before you or anyone says my comments are personal and unkind, can I just say they are not, I am just making a gentle point about reproductive social responsibility here.

Posted by: waterbombe at August 18, 2008 9:19 AM

lookin4missright2 at August 17, 2008 3:15 PM

Exactally!!

Posted by: creativestuart at August 17, 2008 4:13 PM

"Dad?".... "Can we have a talk?". I say "Yes bubby, of cause we can".... "Dad ....can you get me and **a a new mum?". I reply "No worries sweety, i'll just duck out to the 7 Eleven and grab one".
(actual conversation)

....It's just simply not that simple.

Kids aren't stupid! They work it out instinctively that a traditional family group of a mum and a dad is infinitely more fun than a new age mum/dad or dad/mum (how's that for political correctness?) family. It's just us adults that find difficulty seeing that point, and maybe if a few more of us did, there would be a few less of us rambling on here also.

Anyone who possesses any sort of values whatsoever, wouldn't post a profile in this place misrepresenting their family status. It is sheer lunacy to neglect to tell a prospective soul mate that you have children in your care and that they are going to have to accept them as part of any relationship with yourself. Honesty is the keystone to any sucessfull relationship, and any deviation from that undeniable fact, is doomed right from the start.

To those contemplating deception as a sure fire way of attracting Mr./Mrs.right...wake up to yourself before it's too late.

Posted by: lookin4missright2 at August 17, 2008 3:15 PM

I am a single mum of four children and I think that if you don't be honest and upfront in the begning then when is the right time...... I do not believe that the children are or would be the problem ... If the man did not like children to start with he isn't going to change his mind just because he wants you. Anyone that only wants me would not get a second chance with me sorry because my children come first..
If there was anyone out there that thinks that hiding children so that you could trap someone is wrong ..it wouldn't work and i would not like that if someone did that to me....
I always treat people the way I like to be treated....
Jen:)

Posted by: looking4cooking at August 16, 2008 9:27 PM

I two believe honesty is the best policy . As i mum of two 12 and 5 i aways tell others about my kids first . i have had a few dates since becoming a single mum 4 years ago but i must say that having a partner who has kids seems to work better . I dated someone who had no kids and they could not understand why i spent time with my kids and not with him when HE wanted . He seemed to miss the whole "i have kids "thing a would throw a tanty when the kids took my time .

Posted by: sweetblueeyedlady at August 16, 2008 6:10 PM

missrule at August 16, 2008 4:55 PM
LOL misrule :-)
My kids are still a big part of me even tho they are now 28 and 31. I'm proud of the fact that my 28 yr old son had quite a few long discussions with me before he moved to Vietnam to marry and that he still talks to me online regularly letting me know what is going on his life. My daughter has actually gone from a close mother daughter relationship to withdrawing into her own life over the past 10+ years but I'm sure she still knows there is nothing she can't talk to me about if she wants to! It's called TRUST! Takes a life time to build , 5 mins to destroy!

Posted by: waternymph47 at August 16, 2008 6:03 PM

No worries Kaz. It's just that some members of the public (probably red-top readers) have the idea that just because some men enjoy having sex with men, they are also likely to enjoy sex with small boys. I certainly don't believe that.

Waternymph, I'm disgusted at the mother you speak of, but not really surprised. My ex-husband made our son, aged 18 and working, move out of his home because dad's girlfriend didn't want to share him with his own kids.(Luckily our older boy had moved to Australia by that stage anyway.) If objecting to that kind of treachery to your children makes you or me smug, I'm more than happy to be Mrs Smug Smuggety Smug-Smug.

Posted by: missrule at August 16, 2008 4:55 PM

Missrule, l will explain. Gay men are not paedophiles. They enjoy having sex with men. The wording was perhaps what pricked my ears l would say. Thank you for clarifying your point....................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 16, 2008 1:38 PM

Having been sole parent for many years I felt the simplest way to work out if the man I'd just met would ever be introduced to my kids or not was first check his reaction to the fact that I had kids. Second .. ask myself was this a man I might feel proud to introduce to my children. If in doubt don't!
In a discussion once with other single Mum's .. one was bemoaning the fact that her daughter disliked her current man and she was actually considering sending daughter away not the man. I said I trusted my kid's instincts. If they thought there were reasons not to like this man I'd be listening to them and asking them why ,as their intuition was probaly better and more clear sighted than mine!
I got called SMUG ..by this woman who was prepared to give her daughter the flick in favour of her man, but have not changed my opinion.

Posted by: waternymph47 at August 16, 2008 1:28 PM

Marcus, well said re your post of 10.39am today. The fact is that most men are not paedophiles, just as most people don't murder, rape, burgle and steal.

Our instinctual protective mechanism is there and is a hard one to overcome.

BTW, l have a Toyota, did you mena that all people who drove Toyota's were boring? .....................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 16, 2008 1:24 PM

auntykaz, I'm mystified by your reaction. My statement was (as you have correctly quoted it, but with added caps for stress) "I have no idea what the stats are, but I do know it's NOT just the childless who abuse, and certainly NOT only gay men."

In other words, the popular misconception is that these two groups (childless and gay men) are more likely to be child-abusers but I know this is NOT the case. If I had thought otherwise I would NOT have employed a male au pair.

Is that clear enough?

Marcus, my ex would agree enthusiastically with your summing-up - but you missed out "wealthy, good-looking superbrain" :)

I love your joke - at least you recognise male frailty. Big boobs do not a relationship make, so your handsome 40-year-old is obviously no more than a one-night-stander and if your three women are looking for more, they would do well to look elsewhere.

Women don't give half as much credence to a man's car as men tend to think, either. If blokes realised this, I think the sports car (aka p**** extension) market would collapse!

Posted by: missrule at August 16, 2008 12:56 PM

You can sorta feel the pedophile paranoia creeping in to one of the earlier post here. I think statistically any girls kids are much more likely to come to harm from a close relative that a random RSVPer.
The bloke with the Impreza WRX is making a bit of a fashion statement but equally recognises a car with enough design and engineering integrity to win World rally championships. They are one of the all time performance bargains. They have interesting and innovative engineering especially in the 'flat' engine. They have high primary (driving, handling) safety with their 4 wheel drive and excellent brakes and their turbocharged engine helps make them energy efficient for their power.
It hints at an interesting, aware bloke who looks for value, may be reasonably sophisticated and understands the skill and enjoyment in punting a high performance car.
A handsome 40 ish single Dr. Box meets a group of 3 girls at a do in Brighton. They start to talk cars. One, an older school teacherish brunette has a Mazda Tribute, another talkative, rounded physiotherapist a Toyota Yaris and the third, hot thinner blonde personal trainer, who skis, a newish 3 Series Beemer (with racks). Car conversation finishes and the girls are all very friendly. Which one does he choose ?
The one with big boobs.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 16, 2008 10:39 AM

Missrule, you comment" I can relate to your paedophilia comment because years ago I had a male au pair for my sons and was greeted with howls of "how could you?" from friends (male and female). I have no idea what the stats are, but I do know it's not just the childless who abuse, and certainly not only gay men."
Jeez, what a comment to make in regards to childless men and gay men!!
I take it that you are generalising there to the extreme.................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 15, 2008 11:12 PM

Jajo, all of your comments make sense except perhaps (and I say perhaps) the one about waiting for a guy who will "treat your kids like his own". That may well happen and you will be very lucky if it does (there are special guys out there, really!) but it isn't absolutely necessary. He might turn out to be more like a big brother, or an older friend, to them than a parent. I do agree, though, that what you have told your children is very sensible.

Posted by: missrule at August 15, 2008 10:37 PM

I quite agree with jajo's comment - children should come first, they learn what they experience. As a 56 yr old sole parent with a 10 yr old child, it's very interesting to assess male attitudes. Unfortunately a lot of men really don't consider that children have any rights. Just keep believing that there are some men out there with empathy and consideration for all life.

Posted by: happytimes70 at August 15, 2008 10:35 PM

jajo .. I hope you find what you are looking for.. I live for my child and I wouldn't have it any other way. If I find someone I hope they have children as well and they have the same dedication I have to my angel, or that they understand the role that my child has in my life. I believe we all have a lot of love in us and we should be able to share it with more than one person at a time

Posted by: lonle12chat2 at August 15, 2008 10:28 PM

Thanks Marcus - sorry, I did see your comments yesterday but it slipped my mind. You must have thought a lot of the child's mother, initially anyway, to become involved to that extent. Good on you. I don't know about grandstanding but the first comment you made that was deleted really was bang out of order, my son (in best London accent).

I can relate to your paedophilia comment because years ago I had a male au pair for my sons and was greeted with howls of "how could you?" from friends (male and female). I have no idea what the stats are, but I do know it's not just the childless who abuse, and certainly not only gay men.
Some abusers victimise their own children. (I think it was Colchapman who said that you can really only foil abuse by teaching your children about their bodies, and I've done that with all three of mine.)

One can't or shouldn't generalise, and damning a young man who genuinely wants to care for children just because of his gender I think is appalling. The same goes for male primary school teachers - there is plenty of evidence that little boys (especially from broken families) need male role models.

In the event I have had quite a few au pairs over the years and two of the females were ghastly beyond belief. The boy was a total star and we are still in touch.

Cars ... yawn ... oh, okay. A long-term ex of mine is now 54 and drives (always too fast) an Impreza WRX, royal blue with gold wheels. So what does that say about him? Sad overgrown boy racer, possibly? :D

My favourite car was a motorcycle. A Honda Rebel (250CC) - smart little custom bike with sit-up-and-beg handlebars. I always commuted on a bike in London - by far the easiest and cheapest way to get around, and riding is soooo much fun as well!

Posted by: missrule at August 15, 2008 10:28 PM

Wow, reading through these comments has made me have mixed emotions. I am a single mum of 2. A 5 and 7 year old...
I totally understand about the fears of letting a child abuser in your home. I also agree that its not something you can usually judge in someone. usually they are the nicest kind of people because they want you to think they are 'good people'.
I have often felt guilty about wanting to find someone but realise i need to be happy for them to be happy too. I dated one man since my divorce. he is really nice and treats my kids well. i was unsure how to explain things to my kids especially with them being so young and i didnt want them to get attached to someone and hurt if it didnt work (their father is already pretty much a stranger). i just told my kids that sometimes in life we have friends for a little while and then we dont see them again, like when you change schools or with friends from other groups you may be involved in. Well obviously the relationship didn't work out, we are still friends though and the kids see him every now and then. We talk openly about him just like we would anyone else they have met. I do find it hard to find men who are interested in a women with 2 kids 99% of the time and have had a man tell me i am "over devoted to my children". (what a load of s#%&^)
you can not be over devoted to your children.
so i am just waiting for that guy that is going to be happy with treating my kids like his own and enjoy a relationship with all of us. I just hope i won't be waiting for 10 years like one of the other members commented!
I definetly will always be upfront about my kids and put them first (i think this is the only way to be) but i think if i end up in another relationship i will wait until i feel the relationship is going somewhere before introducing my kids to him

Posted by: jajo at August 15, 2008 10:08 PM

I related a little of my experience as a step parent to a girl with a rare syndrome while making a gentle point about reproductive social responsibility here earlier. My perspective wasn't considered worthy, I was seen as grandstanding, was growled at and and then moderated into oblivion. I'ts tough with so much pedophilia paranoia for a single bloke with no kids to even get a leg up when it comes to any interaction with youngsters.
Cars are interesting though and you can tell a lot about a car owner with choice from the vehicle they choose. You have to be careful not to get bored to death by Toyota owners for instance. We cannot see the extent of human evolution, from our earliest ancestors to the present, but with cars we can quite easily examine the changes in engineering and styling of these vital transport tools and cultural icons.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 15, 2008 7:25 PM

... well, if we must ... Ford Escapes are the same as Mazda Tributes (which I own). That's all I'm saying on that topic, because it's all I know.

Posted by: missrule at August 15, 2008 6:49 PM

I find cars chat totally tedious - they're lumps of tin and as long as they get me from A to B or whatever letter of the alphabet I happen to be patronising, that's all I require. I thought this topic was about kids, not skids?

So ... has anyone any experience of step-parenting, i.e. from the other side of the equation? I was in a long relationship with a man who had a little daughter exactly my daughter's age. They became great friends, as you can imagine, and the other mum and I got along fine too.

Then she (mum) applied for extra social security benefits, which got the CSA involved (this was in the UK but the system is the same as here). So my partner was asked for a lot more money, and his response was to stop seeing his daughter (then aged 3). Just like that. We still email occasionally and I know he hasn't seen her since.

With 20-20 hindsight, I should have got out of the relationship then ... needless to say I didn't!

Posted by: missrule at August 15, 2008 6:30 PM

I love BMW..

Posted by: exoticorigin at August 15, 2008 9:17 AM

I bought a 1978 TD Gemini when I was 21. It was metallic green and I loved that car!
It was brilliant, never once broke down on the side of the road, and enabled me to be so independent.
I did quite a number of trips between Warracknabeal and Adelaide by myself and never had a problem.
I only sold it after my first child was born, the boot wasn't quite big enough for all the gear you have to cart once you have a baby!
I really missed it!

Posted by: amberlight58 at August 15, 2008 12:09 AM

Ahh, thank you for the clarification. I wasnt trying to be pedantic. My first car was a TD Gemini panel van. Where that car couldnt go, didnt matter. It was amazing.

Istj: It might have made the other drivers more respectful :)

Posted by: willow29 at August 14, 2008 6:59 PM

willow29 at August 14, 2008 4:56 PM

Isuzu would make the cars in Japan Holden would buy them because they couldn't possibly economically tool up to make the relatively small numbers sold and they would be 'badge engineered' into Holdens.
Ford Lasers of the same era were Mazdas and Mazda sold them as Mazda 323s.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 14, 2008 6:02 PM

My older sister's first car was a morris major...we called it Wally. We had a lot of fun in that car. It was like driving a bus...I went on to a brand new renault...I've only ever had two new cars...then a Rover...Mazda...Cortina...and then in the nineties I finally got my bright blue gemini...it was made in Europe and a better shape than the other...only problem was that I didn't notice the number plate till way too late...COW966

Posted by: istj54 at August 14, 2008 5:54 PM

willow, youre on fire with your proof reading today! lol
there certainly was the holden gemini, but were they around in the 70s? maybe they WERE isuzu before holden took it over?? i nearly bought a holden gemini myself, but that was in the mid 80s....

Posted by: kisskat at August 14, 2008 5:50 PM

Weren't they Holden Geminis in the 70's?

Posted by: willow29 at August 14, 2008 4:56 PM

istj54 at August 13, 2008 8:02 PM
Who would have wanted to drive a Morris Major when you could have a real small car like the Bellet? After the Bellets finished cool chicks were driving Isuzu Gemini's in the 70's. The bloke I mentioned with the 100mph Bellet had two daughters and both ended up driving Gemini's one a green and the other a purple 2 door.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 14, 2008 4:03 PM

emptyalone, I think it's great you shared that treatment information. There may be someone (or more) that can really benefit from what you have learnt so far within your family; something that could make all the difference in their lives and that of their children. If it's improved the quality of your family's life, I'm very glad for you.

Posted by: malsie at August 14, 2008 10:51 AM

amourmoi08 - the empytlone was a low moment, and all the good names were taken :)

I'm all blushin now at your kind words thank you.

Back to the origional reason why I did post my personal bits, anyone has a child with Autism, Bio-Medical is an option. Its just diet and lifestyle changing on your behalf. Worth it. I think with my tribe I'm qualified to sy its worth a go for your family.

Posted by: emptyalone at August 14, 2008 8:50 AM

Posted by: emptyalone at August 13, 2008 10:28 PM

What a diamond in the sand you are.
Please know that you are never empty nor alone as your name would suggest.

You are filled with kind words and have the patience of a saint.

Have the forgiving nature of Mother Theresa.

The wisdom far beyond recognition for those that choose to stir the pot and leave the blog when things get tricky.

While ever you are on this site you will always have a friend in me.

Peace out xxxxxxxxxxxxx

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 14, 2008 8:16 AM

Posted by: waterbombe at August 13, 2008 8:21 PM

I am so onto you RSVP ; all over you like a itchy rash that won't go away.

We are all big people and capable of using words and agreeing to the terms and conditions of this blog page so stop being so Chinese and behave like the Tibetans.

Peace out, love everyones comments and refuse to be gagged into a vortex of the right to say ones thoughts even if they are off the mark!

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 13, 2008 8:49 PM

My first car was an Isuzu Bellet...I thought myself very cool indeed:))...made lots of noise as it had a twin exhaust...even cooler, I thought.

Posted by: istj54 at August 13, 2008 8:02 PM

Grg.
A mate's old man in Ararat had a couple of Bellet's in the mid 70's. We viewed his claims of their 100 mph+ 179 EH and HR Holden X2 beating performance with a bit of bush scepticism.
That is until my friend and I 'borrowed' one late one night and put it to the test on Shea's flat. Old Oigle was right.
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 13, 2008 4:15 PM

Do I "keep Mum" ? absolutely not. Once an online conversation has commenced I mention that how many children I have living at home and how often they are with my ex husband. I am also very specific however and stipulate that I am ONLY looking to meet up every fortnight on weekends( when children with their dad ) and possibly occasionally during the week, that I am independent , have other commitments etc. Have also indicated that am not after casual encounters but more a mature respectful friendship that acknowledges each other's space. Has worked a treat for me thus far.

Posted by: anewday8 at August 13, 2008 3:58 PM

Wow, Emptyalone, that's a very decent and generous response of yours to Marcus's question. In asking that dreadful question, Marcus showed himself to be someone who entirely lacks those qualities that you have in abundance. I admire you. Your children are very lucky to have you as a mum, and any man you choose to be your partner will be a very fortunate guy.

Posted by: waterbombe at August 13, 2008 2:47 PM

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 10, 2008 8:30 PM

I remember my old man telling me about Parents without Pants in the late 60s. A bloke who worked for him belonged to it and according to the old man did very nicely at PwP although he used more descriptive language.
I cant reember the blokes name but I do remember his car. An Isuzu Bellet GT. In those days you could tell a lot about a man from the car he drove!!
rgds grego

Posted by: grego7 at August 12, 2008 6:16 PM

Interesting questions Ellida,
I find it a challenge being a single parent and I feel enriched by the experience and must be honest and say that I contribute much of who I am to the things I have learned about myself in this role. I acknowledge that being a single Mum is part of who I am. It is not all of who I am, but my decisions will be based on my responsibilities in this role. It would be deceptive and unfair for me to leave someone guessing as to what my motives may be in making those decisions, especially when it could affect them. In my opinion honesty s always the best policy. I also want to know whether people I meet are parents or not. Whether or not they are currently parenting is not the issue. Being a parent usually brings with it some understanding and awareness. I don't feel the need to embroil my children or someone I have just met, into a whirl wind of introductions. Nor do I feel the need to talk about them to each other in the initial stages. Time will tell whether those introductions will be made.

Posted by: happyseagypsy at August 12, 2008 5:24 PM

amourmoi08 said "I don't allow my children to be subjected to my fascination with my eternal search for mr wonderful.
I protect my kids from my social life and do not discuss any dates."

I agree with you on this 100%

spunkymuffin - I would recommend it to anyone, we are gluten free and dairy free, I would fill up this whole page with the info I could give you. If you search for MINDD you can see more. I think the basic quickie explination, they look at the child as a whole starting from the stomache, their bio make up, and change their diet to help carm them and make the body work the way it should. VERY basic in that description and alot more I could put, but I want the moderators to allow this info to come through to you. I dont have any stamps or I would contact you and give you the low down.

I love what bio med has given to my twin girls who never use to speak at 4, and now they are starting to speak and have more moments of clarity. They are both low functioning.
good luck

Posted by: emptyalone at August 11, 2008 11:03 PM

Medievallady,
While I understand where you are coming from, I admire twoeyes for being honest and upfront. Much better than someone who pretends they don't mind, but then acts jealous and sulky when you have to put your children first! Give me honesty every time!

Good one, Marcus :)

emptyalone,
I can only imagine just how hard it is for you. And very lonely at times. Are you involved in any support groups?

Posted by: amberlight58 at August 11, 2008 10:14 PM

emptyalone - no am not doing bio-medical... What does it entail? what have ur experiences been? Having some major issues with my girl at the mo, so would be appreciative of any advice

Posted by: spunkymuffin at August 11, 2008 11:15 AM

I don't allow my children to be subjected to my fascination with my eternal search for mr wonderful.
I protect my kids from my social life and do not discuss any dates.
Kids are easily hurt and they will never love a new partner more than they love thier own parent and you should never ever ask them to, it hurts them and they will be angry little people that will grow up with more baggage than Qantas is dealing with.
Be aware of your environment and understand the difference between love, lust, crazy hot sex and never do any of the above mentioned in front of your children.
Did your parents tell you everything that they did, how they met and how you as a child came to be here? If they loved you well they would have but they told you at an age when you would understand.
Keep it simple and say it will love. LA Amour 08 xx

Posted by: amourmoi08 at August 10, 2008 11:36 PM

Hi 5 Waterlily for your comments. 2eyes in my opinion and yes it is only my opinion, you are selfish, I'm talking from previous experience. After my 16yrs marriage ended, I dated 1 guy on and off for over 7 years. It was our own boys (combined) that got us together, and we have this incredible (bond) friendship (I need more), but thats all he wants because he likes his space and "us time" - his exact words. His kids don't live with him and he loves having his "freedom" he calls it. He has admitted to loving me, and I love him, but we will never live together while I have my children. That is horrible. So I find although I love him and he me, I have to let him go because I love my kids more. I feel like a kept woman because he loves what we have, but doesn't want my children. My children are my world, and if a man can't handle that or them, then sorry kids win every time, no matter how much you grow to love them. Guys you either learn to accept the family as a whole, or hit the road, you will lose all the time.

Posted by: medievallady at August 10, 2008 11:27 PM

amberlight58 - Thank you, I dont feel special at all, its rather 'blah' at times having this on my own.

spunkymuffin - My 4 are Autistic too. Are you doing bio-medical? If not its worth a look. Made a huge difference in our family dynamics.

Parents without Partners - now there is a blast from the past. Does anyone know if it is still up and running? Maybe RSVP should organize meetings like their social dinners on the same idea. Or would that be too freeky?

Posted by: emptyalone at August 10, 2008 8:34 PM

thelynathdairy at August 10, 2008 7:47 PM

They are still around in the burbs I think, just changed the name to 'Parents without Pants'
Cheers Marcus

Posted by: laughsandtalks at August 10, 2008 8:30 PM

What 21 month old isn't gorgeous Col. how could you not love them all.

Posted by: iaminperth at August 10, 2008 8:08 PM

I'm with you Mutley, I would hope that anyone deciding to love me would also love my daughter. Like, how on earth couldn't they. She's gorgeous. (but enough self indulgence)

I am a parent and proud of it...only another parent can know that feeling.

What i deeply and truly want is a partner who loves both of us, she would either have children of her own or want more children together.

I look forward to meeting her.

Posted by: colchapman1 at August 10, 2008 7:53 PM

Whatever happened to "Parents without Partners" .. a relic from pre internet days?

I remember whispers about a local widow and a DIVORCED man who met at one of their 'meetings' (I can hear my Mother saying 'meetings' over the fence to the next door neighbour in that tone which was very interesting to a young girl).. I think they married too...a quiet ceremony deemed appropriate considering how they met and his shocking marital status.......

Posted by: thelynathdiary at August 10, 2008 7:47 PM

I tell ppl about my kids straight off the bat. My daughter is Autistic, so I feel that it's important to be upfront about that (plus I'm not ashamed of it, so if someone isn't interested in that aspect, I want to know that from the start) Plus, we are a package deal, so if they don't like or want the kids, there is not point in pursuing it.

Posted by: spunkymuffin at August 10, 2008 7:33 PM

Thanks for the suggestion willow, most appreciated, should I get inspired I may well undertake your idea. I dont think it is your eyes they look fine in your profile which is pretty cool.

Posted by: mutley4 at August 10, 2008 3:39 PM

amber, I don't know if he has any regrets about it, but I tend to think he missed out on something that could have been quite special for him, yet he always assumed he would have his own kids one day. I think you summed it up perfectly when you say "Sometimes I think we miss out on a lot of life trying to obtain this idyllic dream that is in our heads."

Posted by: malsie at August 10, 2008 3:37 PM

Mutley, may I make a suggestion about your profile? Break the main blurb into smaller paragraphs. Its a bit hard on the eyes to read it all on the screen. (maybe its just my eyes... bg) Otherwise, very nice :)

Posted by: willow29 at August 10, 2008 2:42 PM

Malsie, how sad that the man you described couldn't get past his "idealisation" of what a perfect family was! Seems so many have this idea of what a family "should" be and are not willing to entertain the idea that life could be really wonderful if they could just compromise a little bit.
I agree we are not born with a limited capacity to love. We are capable of loving many people in different ways.
He probably really regrets that he allowed his narrow perspective of life stop him from achieving his dream to be a dad.

Your story reminds me that we all need to be open to new perspectives on life. We all tend to grow up with an image of an "ideal" partnership and family. (And often that may not be something that we have ever experienced ourselves!) Sometimes I think we miss out on a lot of life trying to obtain this idyllic dream that is in our heads.
I look back now and realise I wasted many years waiting for my ex to become the husband and father I really wanted him to be, when he was never willing to try or probably more so, maybe he was not even capable, of being that person.
I know now life would have been much happier for my kids growing up if the "penny had dropped" 10 years or even 5 years earlier!
I may still not have found another partner, but I realise now my kids would have been a lot happier without the resentment that pervaded the relationship between their parents.
But I was stubborn, I wanted that "dream family" and tried to make it happen by organising family holidays as a "bonding" exercise that were always a disaster, and my older kids now tell me thay have few happy memories of their childhood.

Sometimes we really do need to do a "reality check" to see if the ideals in our head REALLY are what is best for us and those we love!

Posted by: amberlight58 at August 10, 2008 2:24 PM

LBN, what a lovely post. You sound like a very empathetic person and very mature.
It must have been so hard for you with your step-mother's attitude at such a young age. It is an awful shame your father felt he had to "choose" between you and his wife.
It is a credit to your understanding t hat you gave them both another chance!
I tend to agree with missrule (Clare) about there being some mental instability there. Your stepmother doesn't sound as if she'd be easy to live with!

No Clare I haven't read that book, but I will see if it's available at our local library. Sounds a hoot!

Emptyalone,
You are one special person to be coping with 4 special needs children! I hope you find another special person who has the capacity and heart to love you and all your children.

Posted by: amberlight58 at August 10, 2008 1:49 PM

spikysparky, your comment reminded me very much of an ex partner of mine whom I met when we were both 30. My daughter was 8 at the time, and this guy was getting to the point where he wanted to settle down and have his own children. We did get involved with each other, but he was constantly concerned about not wanting to be a stepfather to my daughter, preferring to save all his "love" for his own children (a concept I found hard to understand as I don't believe love to be a finite commodity, but that's how he felt). He had a good friendship with my daughter, and she adored him, but he maintained some kind of distance, and still regarded this as not his "ideal" situation - was waiting, waiting, waiting.... for his "own" children....
Well, 20 years on, he's still single and childless, and to my mind missed out on something by not allowing himself to get that close to my daughter.
In no way am I saying you should think, feel or act differently or that I don't respect your decisions - only that reading your comments took me right back to the situation I've just described.

Posted by: malsie at August 10, 2008 11:17 AM

To start any relationship based on a deception in my oppinion is a relationship set for failure. Why on earth would you not admit to who you are? Do you yourself see your chidren as baggage? Are you indeed in touch with who you are and that being a parent will not change and lying about it suggests you are not quite ready to accept that as being a part of who you are.
Do you really want to bring someone into your world and that of your child if they may have a problem with that? Do you expect to change their views? Good luck changeing anyone, we do not have that sort of power.
Honesty about everything is a must for me in any relationship. Good luck all.

Posted by: mutley4 at August 10, 2008 9:20 AM

colchapman1 at August 9, 2008 10:12 AM Col, I think that's why it's safest for a parent (especially of a younger child) to date only other parents - non-parents may seem to accept your child/ren but they cannot be expected to empathise in a situation where you have to put the child's needs first. It's not worth the risk of ending up having to decide between your partner or your child. I know this can still happen with someone who does have their own children but IMO (and experience), it's less likely.

littlebitnutty at August 9, 2008 12:55 PM: wow, you have really been through the mill! Your stepmother must be suffering from some kind of mental illness (has she been diagnosed, do you know?) and it's a shame your father dealt with this by cutting off contact with you. Many in your situation would have sworn never to speak to him again, etc, so it's greatly to your credit that you have rebuilt all your family relationships and have such a mature attitude to them all.

It sounds as though you are questioning whether you could be partly responsible for your stepmother's latest outburst, but mental illness is unpredictable and illogical - she probably has no idea where it has come from and almost certainly can't help herself. I hope you are able to get through this latest trial with no damage to that relationship.

As for your stepfather, it sounds as though there is a lot of insecurity there, and it's your mother's job to reassure him that their relationship is not threatened by her closeness to you. I really hope you are able to overcome all of your early difficulties and find happiness in your own right.

amberlight58 at August 9, 2008 11:52 AM - have you read "The Blessing" by Nancy Mitford? If not, it's about a little brat who does his best to keep his separated parents apart, because their (very rich) new partners are so keen to hang onto their relationships that they spoil the child ridiculously. As his parents show signs of reconciling, he tries ever more desperately to ensure they don't. It's hilarious, especially the ending - I recommend it as a light bedtime read (esp if, like me, that's all you do at bedtime ;) )!

Claire, 51, divorced + 3, NSW mid-north coast

Posted by: missrule at August 10, 2008 8:04 AM

There is some very interesting views below that I hadent thought of before. Great to see. I have 5 children, 4 of them have special needs.

I meet a guy a few months ago, actually bought something from him for my sons birthday. We got chatting, as you do, and I realized he was being 'fresh'. I said straight up, I have 5 kids. Oldest is 15 and the youngest is 2. He never blinked, never paused just said "cool" and went on to ask questions about names ages etc.

When I then hit him with their special needs, again no pause nothing, just went onto questions about it and admitted he heard of Autism but knew nothing.

But at the end of that 30 min conversation he still was being 'fresh' and wanted to have coffee sometime.

He never once was worried about my kids. He met them all. They liked him. Other circumstances came up with his past relationship that meant we had to end the relationship before it got started.

I cant help but feel now that men like that dont come around often. In the gee feels like almost 2 years I've been single, guys run when they hear you have 5 children, and if they dont, soon as they hear about the special needs that usually gets them.

And I guess it isnt an easy thing to deal with. Guess I dont blame them.

You have to be so upfront and honest with people these days.

But in saying that 6 months ago I was out at a bar in Melbourne, I live in Brisbane, and started chatting to a guy. I never denyed I had children, just never mentioned it. I said I was single. Left it at that. I knew we wouldnt see each other again. It was nice to play single person again for the one night (and in saying that want to add it was not a one night stand) just a night of drinks, flirting and laughter. And not explaining my family and their disability.

It was nice to be female again and not 'Mother to 5 kids 4 with special needs'.

Posted by: emptyalone at August 9, 2008 11:29 PM

Nutty and Amberlight such well written posts, and eyesx2 a good explaination of your viewpoint. I think one thing that this topic has shown is that children affect all of us whether they are our own or someone elses. It can be a peril or a joy, but to have a child in our lives is certainly a challenge at times................K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 9, 2008 10:07 PM

littlebit.....your generosity of spirit is beautiful and I feel for you and send you my heartfelt admiration. I guess you are part of the generation of kids that just had to come to tems with the fact that families don't last forever anymore....
Cheers,
B.

Posted by: bm1960 at August 9, 2008 9:41 PM

Thought I might offer a "child's"perspective on this (although, note I am almost 27 so "child" in the sense of being a child to my parents).

My parents divorced when I was 2. It was amicable and I was too young to know any different. After the divorce, my father became a born again Christian and met my stepmother through the church. He remarried when I was 7 and had two more children soon after. I wasn't a bratty child about it; she didn't break up my family, my parents never lived together as far as I knew at that age. Shortly after the birth of their second child, she had some kind of breakdown and decided I was a "threat" to HER family. My Dad barely saw or spoke to me for about 3 years from about 9 - 12 years. It did some serious damage to me.

When I had my own little breakdown at around 15 years, my stepmother apologised profusely. I forgave her whole-heartedly and it was never spoken of again; nor did I ever tell her how much it had all hurt me.

I am now a few months off 27. After some years of rebuilding our relationship, my Dad, stepmother, half-brother and sister managed to build up a fantastic, close relationship. I described her as my "second Mum" and one of my "best friends". This was until a week ago when she had a brain explosion and did her nut at me (I'm still trying to figure out where this came from). I'd spent a week in the snow with them (perhaps this was it - I'd encroached for more than my standard overnight stay). She accused me of needing to get over my parents divorce (odd when I never even really knew it happened). Too much damage is now done.

My Mum, on the other hand, raised me and we have an incredibly close bond given it was just the two of us. She met a lovely, wonderful man on RSVP in 2006 and they married last year. He has struggled with my relationship with her and even queried whether I was trying to break them up (I moved out when they got married but still came home alot because of the closeness with my Mum and he took this to mean I was trying to muscle back in). In reality, I had spent every night of my life praying for a good man to come into her life and think I would be just as devastated as she would be if it didn't work out with them. I love him to pieces and I am incredibly happy for them. With the explosion of my stepmother, the penny has finally dropped with my stepfather and he has apologised and asked my forgiveness, which I have given to him.

Oddly enough - he has two adult children a bit younger than me and my Mum struggles with them a bit and here I usually sit trying to mediate the situation; telling her off for being a hypocrite (ie. he must accept me but she can sit on the fence about whether she accepts them). Yet she's filthy at my stepmother for her behaviour. Ahhh...the joys of new families...they can be such a tangled web at times.

I always wanted my parents to meet other people because I don't like the idea of them being on their own. When I was younger it was a little bit tougher, but I agree that children should not be able to dictate their parent's life. We do grow up, we do go off and build our own nest and it is only fair that our parents do the same. Perhaps it's an age thing, but I also think it has a lot to do with the "new person" themselves and how they can slot into the relationship. But I think my case demonstrates that such relationships are difficult and take time to work out even when the "child" is actually an adult.

Posted by: littlebitnutty at August 9, 2008 12:55 PM

Col that is a good explaination and one that l think that most parents would relate to.
Especially if your children are young, it surely would be a vital point as younger children are in our lives so much more than older ones.
With my kids there are times that we are but ships that pass in the night due to starting and finishing times of our respective jobs as well as social commitments and the day to day living that we all have.
Slipping into our very easy and comfortable lives together when we are actually in the house at the same time is a given to us.

However anyone who comes into my life, well a man that comes into my life, is also coming into their lives as well, for as long as they live with me this is not just my home but our home, and the easy comfort still needs to be there.
My kids are quite happy for me to be in a relationship, and if l am happy then so are they, but they will not suffer fools being here, as you can understand.
I don't think that this is putting them above any man, more a reality in most situations. ...............K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 9, 2008 12:17 PM

I tend to agree with you col, I would expect if a man I had a relationship with had younger children, he would put them first. And understand that I would do the same, after all, partners can come and go but we are parents for life.
I think maybe where WL is coming from is in the situation where a child gets to decide whether his or her parent actually has a new relationship.
Some children become such a powerful force in their parents' lives that the parent can't sustain a relationship because the child does their best to sabotage any new relationship, or even any potentially new relationship every time. They want to keep the parent for themselves and not share them with anyone else

This is certainly not the child's fault, it is quite natural to not to want to share a parent (especially the parent of the opposite sex) even when both the child's biological parents are still together.
It is quite normal and part of a child's development.
However, it tends to be the way today that children often participate in decisions that when I was growing up were never even considered a child's business.
My parents never even thought of asking me if I wanted to move states, even when I was 15, they just decided that they wanted to move and that was it!
I would imagine that this would rarely happen these days! All hell would break loose!

Because children have more input into their parents' lives than we did, a child these days not wanting their parent to re-partner can make life pretty difficult for a new person in their parent's life! No matter how much that person tries to be friendly and understanding.

I think was WL is saying is that it is a good idea to be aware of this that's all, and be aware that your daughter may need gentle firmness on your behalf if she refuses to allow someone new into your life.
It is natural that any new person may make her feel insecure and frightened that you may not care about her as much, and she will need your reassurance (and evidence!) that you will not push her away or abandon her, but be aware she may try to put you in a position of choosing between her or your partner as part of this process!

She wil eventually grow up and become her own person and live her own life. If she has learned to dictate the terms of your life, and you have never re-partnered, you will be left alone, and she probably won't care!
That is just the way it is raising children, we love them and they are first in our lives, then they grow up and leave us.
That is the way it is meant to be!

Posted by: amberlight58 at August 9, 2008 11:52 AM

Posted by: waterlily58 at August 7, 2008 7:17 PM

waterlily maybe i didnt explain properly enuff.......... If there are the trials and stuff that require a child to come home thats fine no problem. In fact I would be disappointed if that didnt happen. I meant that small children and even teenagers need a huge amount of time from their parents. If there is only one of them then double the amount is needed. For example

sports training, sports meetings dance classes swimming training etc etc etc not to mention the "i need to be at such and such a place right now" are all times when a parent is needed. Not to say that if the relationship had progressed enough for them to maybe let me take them somewhere they needed to be, that I wouldnt do it. I know its all part of the relationship but me time with the mother is more of what I am looking for.

I understand that exclusivity isnt possible in this type of arrangement, and thats not what I want. I am not sure if this has made it any clearer or not..............

Posted by: twoeyes at August 9, 2008 10:57 AM

Waterlily58, my comment about 'love me, love my daughter' was more in keeping with the theme of this blog about keeping children a secret with a prospective date/partner.
It certainly had nothing to do with relegating a partner to 2nd place.
Fortunately I haven't had any relationships go down the tube based on my attitude of placing the needs of my little girl first and foremost.
I think you may have misunderstood my comment. I think you would have to agree that anyone entering into a relationship with me is in fact also entering into a relationship with my daughter.

Posted by: colchapman1 at August 9, 2008 10:12 AM

I agree Kaz, what's the point. I think all this phoney 'overpleasing' of another person is an extremely dangerous idea and can lead to huge resentment later on. I have a dog, well obviously, if you don't like animals you won't like me. Well actually I have some friends who don't like animals and they do like me, just don't want to come to my house so we go out. But you do know what I mean, if you don't like kids, that's your problem not mine. Would I be interested in someone who didn't like children or animals, definitely no,.

Posted by: iaminperth at August 9, 2008 9:04 AM

Posted by: waterlily58 at August 8, 2008 8:57 PM

waterlily not sure why youre relating your blog comment to mine, but anyway, if you see such a pattern forming in your relationships, you gotta wonder why & take steps to do/say something about it

Posted by: kisskat at August 9, 2008 6:26 AM

I always let someone know in my first email that I have 3 children & 2 of them have special needs from a genetic condition (due to the dishonesty of my former husband who passed it to them!). I find honesty is the best policy on RSVP so we are not wasting each other's time. I do not put these details on my profile because I feel that my profile is about myself and not my children.

Posted by: bmnaturegirl at August 9, 2008 1:00 AM

I would never hide the fact that Im a parent. Im happy to tell the world Im a mum.

My son is the best thing that has ever happened to me and is a part of my life and I would hope that any prospective partner would understand that.

We're a package deal so to speak.

Posted by: whitewitch38 at August 9, 2008 12:50 AM

I think the next blog should be about how full-time parents find time to date!
I think most have well and truely established that saying they have kids right from the start saves a hell of a lot of time!
Never in my life would I think of avoiding a subject like that, and is typically the first thing I mention when people seem to pop out of the woodwork.
Though, I have also been on the other end where I have been avoided at all costs whilst my own mother dated. I was already an adult, but by god it hurt. Nobody deserves to be treated like that no matter their age.

Posted by: soottles at August 9, 2008 12:15 AM

To have kids is the greatest gift that could be bestowed upon you, you aren't a parent for a few years but a lifetime. I have 3, albeit adults now but would still drop everything at the drop of a hat if they needed me. I would expect a partner would understand that as I should if the same ever cropped up with their children. I was once asked would I move away from my kids and live interstate well I never got to live interstate. It is not that a partner is put second behind someones kids but depending on the priority at the time one or the other will be treated first no different than in a normal marriage. Be honest be up front if they are not comfortable with you having children then let them move on. Life is too short to deal with this type of selfishness.

Posted by: centaur60 at August 8, 2008 11:21 PM

I cannot understand why anyone would hide the fact that they are a parent.
How silly !!

Mine are both adults but they still exist for heavens sake.
One living at home one moving out next week, well at least the house will be a more tidy place, but l will sure miss her being around every day...........K

Posted by: auntykaz at August 8, 2008 9:09 PM

Posted by: colchapman1 at August 8, 2008 12:59 PM
I don't necessarily agree with your statement: 'love me, love my daughter'. Any woman that you meet would be dating YOU, a grown male, not your daughter.

If your daughter is part of the package deal, then it is YOUR job to ensure that both the lady and your daughter are secure enough in their relationship with you, to wish to exist concurrently.

Have you had relationships go down the tubes because of this 'love me, love my daughter' attitude? Because, with this kind of take on life, your daughter knows that she will always be number one, and that the lady will always come in second.

Great for the daughter, but very, very hard on the lady, and you.

Posted by: waterlily58 at August 8, 2008 9:02 PM

Posted by: kisskat at August 8, 2008 4:16 PM
Kisskat, it's not so much that we don't love our kids, or try to hide them, the problem stems when you are the full time parent, constantly being asked to offload your kids for 'us time', and then being landed with a tribe of toddlers when it is his time to be a part time-parent.

Posted by: waterlily58 at August 8, 2008 8:57 PM

It is hard being a single parent, and whilst I would love to share this journey with another, I am content with my life. I have been a single parent for 8 out of my sons 9 years. I have always been up front that I am a single parent, and my kid comes first. But now it is kids as I am now caring for a child aged 7, who has joined our family.

I did pursue a relationship, with someone with children (they had 3) prior to our new addition to the family. We did start just as friends having meet online through a single parents group. We would go out and do fun activities with the kids. It was great to find someone who understood the difficulties of single parent life, and who also felt that they didn't want to intrude on friends who where partnered, as weekends were there family time. Our kids bonded very well (3 years in total), and when the relationship broke down, I was heart broken and so was my son. The hardest part for both of us, was not being able to see the other children.

Like others I am a parent 24/7, but I wouldn't trade any of it for a life partner. If it happens fantastic, if it doesn't then so be it. I will still be happy. :)

Posted by: samperth1 at August 8, 2008 8:34 PM

My Son is my greatest Achievement, i could not imagine my live without him. While i may have faults he is perfect. I've you haven't been honest with your profile, then your not being honest with yourself or your sibling.

a round of applause to you all.

Posted by: drynlime at August 8, 2008 8:22 PM

But wait...there is more....:-)....When my son was 12, I was seeing a fellow and he suggested we all go to the Easter Show...so we did and I paid for me and my son deliberately.....however, the 'boyfriend' got very annoyed because I said I would be with my son at whichever stall, ride etc. he wanted to go to....the 'boyfriend' was outraged that I wouldn't just let my son wander a huge place like the showground on his own! He did not have any children so often had derogatory comments about how I put my child before him!!! Is it any wonder that I am a jaded, cynical and confused person?! By the same token. I realise tht anyone with kidshas to put them first, but at this stage in my life, I prefer to hang out with parents of older kids.
Cheers,
B.

Posted by: bm1960 at August 8, 2008 7:07 PM

I have a lot of situations to share.....one that comes to mind was when a guy I had been dating a few times constantly commented on how well-mannered, well-adjusted and pleasant my 20 year old son is. The 'date' has 3 daughters under 8....he said he admired the relationship that my son and I have built and continue to grow....then he proceeded to give me parenting advice. I found that to be patronising and made a hasty retreat. He also gave me unsolicited advice on how I should get rid of friends in my life that appear to be needy....I read that as to be a way to manipulate control...not nice.
Cheers,
B.

Posted by: bm1960 at August 8, 2008 6:48 PM

hmm not sure i really like the tone of the intro for this blog.....im VERY proud of my kids and there is no way i would pretend i didnt have kids for the sake of getting a date (or for any reason for that matter).

Posted by: kisskat at August 8, 2008 4:16 PM

Posted by: colchapman1 at August 8, 2008 12:59 PM

Col, liked the bike. Enjoy every moment with your little girl. They grow up too fast and before you know it they are leaving their old dad. My girls are 21 and 16 and seems they grew in a flash.
rgds grego

Posted by: grego7 at August 8, 2008 4:08 PM

Wotswot, welcome - and cramming your life is always the best way, I reckon :)

Posted by: willow29 at August 8, 2008 3:58 PM

I am a proud Mama. My daughter is very much part of the package. What does get interesting is trying to arrange dates because I have her 24/7 with only 4 weeks a year when she goes to visit her Dad. So lunch during the week has become popular (my own version of speed dating) and cramming when she does go away. There really never is a dull moment :)

Posted by: here2cwotswot at August 8, 2008 3:15 PM

Aquaamanda - I am giggling away here at your typing mistake..'youngest dopes'..:-)
Amberlight - true, I guess those of us who have been there, done that could share a lot of stories, thanks.
Cheers,
B.

Posted by: bm1960 at August 8, 2008 1:15 PM

As a single dad I simply couldn't pretend my daughter doesn't exist just to secure a date or get a girl to be interested in me.

I'm only interested in dating girls that already know I have a daughter.

Love me, love my daughter.

I can understand people wanting to protect their children from possible abuse, but as someone who has several decades experience in child abuse investigations and reporting rest assured of one thing. You will never know the person is an abuser until they do it.

The best way to protect your children from being abused is to teach them protective behaviours.

Posted by: colchapman1 at August 8, 2008 12:59 PM

BM, don't be sorry, you are still a mum!
You have every right to say what you think!
Some single mums with really young kids may find the ideas and opinions of those who have "been through it all" as well, quite interesting.
The same as for dads.

Posted by: amberlight58 at August 8, 2008 11:56 AM

In hindsight, I maybe should have kept out of this topic, as I don't have young children and this is likely a topic to allow those who do have share opinions etc. Sorry.
Cheers,
B.

Posted by: bm1960 at August 7, 2008 11:02 PM

does...not dopes sheesh

Posted by: aquamanda56 at August 7, 2008 10:53 PM

My children are all adults, though the youngest dopes still live with me. They are happy to see me happy ,but they would not be slow to say something if they thought the person i was seeing was not good enough for me.

On the other hand, I would be reluctant to start dating a man who had quite young children. I have been through the child raising phase and don't really want to go back there. women are very protective of their brood and I would not want to be the third wheel. It would take a very special man for me to be involved with him if he had young children. To go into that level of commitment would be a huge step, not something I would take on lightly.

Posted by: aquamanda56 at August 7, 2008 10:52 PM

Before I get shot for the previous comment, I realise, and respect that there are many different circumstances as to why people have children later in life. It just doesn't suit me.
Cheers,
B.

Posted by: bm1960 at August 7, 2008 9:53 PM

Waterlily58....have we perhaps dated the same fellows?? :-)
I am always upfront and tell people that I have brought up my own (wonderful) son and I love my nephews and neice, but I am footloose and fancyfree the rest of the time.Sounds self-absorbed, but that is how it is.
As to the last line in your post at 7.03pm....I agree totally. Certainly not my cup of tea.
Cheers,
B.

Posted by: bm1960 at August 7, 2008 9:46 PM

It is a bit hard to deny you have children if you have them listed in your profile. And think if you lie about the fact that you have children it would not be a good way to start a relationship. I have it easier than most as my youngest son is 17 so it isn't a matter of having to drag my son along on a date.

My son would like to see me with a new partner as would my two daughters and they have no misgivings about it as long as I am happy. They all know that this person is not replacing their mother. The person I am dating is for me not for them.. It is for my soul that I am dating a new friend.

Posted by: patc111960 at August 7, 2008 7:19 PM

Posted by: twoeyes at August 6, 2008 9:25 AM

Twoyeyes, before I had my children, my parents told me: "The day you hold your first child in your arms for the first time, you will become a parent for the rest of your life". That's a long time.

My parents have been there for me and my brothers for all of our lives, and are still there for all of us at any hour of the night or day, for whatever reason. I constantly strive to be the same for my kids - always their loving and supportive parent.

This blog indicates that many parents on this site feel the same way about their kids.

Do you honestly believe that you cannot have enough 'us time' to have a strong, healthy relationship, with kids?

If I sat around waiting for my parenting days to be over before I started dating or a relationship, then, well, I guess I'll be lying in a coffin before I'll be lying in a man's arms again.

I'm not saying that your views are selfish. But, if you do find someone with their kids grown and the nest empty, what would happen when one of life's little crisis erupts and the kids need to come home, or need support, or time or money or whatever? Sometimes these issues can take a long time to help support and heal, too - just like waiting for the kids to grow up and leave again. Do you dump the good lady when her parental duties kick in, because they interupt your 'us time'?

Posted by: waterlily58 at August 7, 2008 7:17 PM

Posted by: bm1960 at August 5, 2008 8:44 PM

I really dislike, being told to "get rid of the kids so we can have some time together". My kids are late-teens and are not awfully time consuming or invasive. They pretty much have lives of their own, and come home to eat, sleep and junk-up their rooms, and, every so often sit and have a chat about what life is up to for them, a game of footie, or the planned family get togethers where attendance is all-but compulsory.

On the toss of the coin, when their access weekend rolls around, the same guys are only too keen to drag their very young kids along, turning dinner into Macca's, tv into the Wiggles and a quiet, tidy house into a play gym. Strange how they expect you to play happy families with their kids!

Maybe it's because most (MOST) guys are not full time parents (access only) and are used to having plenty of free time, child free, to indulge themselves, while someone else has all the responsibilities of caring for their kids. Therefore, they expect that you can just drop all of your responsibilities to indulge them with your time and attention, too.

What's with 50-something guys with 1-2yr old babies-toddlers?

Posted by: waterlily58 at August 7, 2008 7:03 PM

spikysparky at August 6, 2008 11:58 PM
and
missrule at August 6, 2008 9:02 PM ...
You both put forward valid points. Someone elses kids may not be easy to deal with and if you both have kids that you need to blend you stand to be placed in a never ending battle where kids play one parent off against the other. You realy have to love and trust your own kids for a starter and then love and trust your partner and their kids as well. A big ask and requires a big heart and a lot of love and patience .. but above all Openness and Honesty!
Lots of open communication between parents and kids. Of course ex spouses can make things difficult too so added problem there with potential again for kids to manipulate this for their own ends!
I think it really only gets a bit easier when you have kids that are grown up and left home and hopefully mature enough to accept the new partner into Mum or Dad's life.
Missrule.. the horror of child abuse sadly is not restricted to single parent families.. as you said yourself .. it can happen in the seemingly settled 'normal' 2 parent family too!
Wasn't it Malcolm Fraser who (over)used the phrase "Life wasn't meant to tbe easy !"..? As if he'd know ?!

Posted by: waternymph47 at August 7, 2008 11:51 AM

Lot of interesting comments here. I thought I would add something to this topic... the perspective of a single, childless 36yo male looking for a female.

I think it is ESSENTIAL to inform your "date" that you have children. There are many reasons for.

Firstly, honesty is important, regardless of what it is about.

Now, what I am about to say next may shock and possibly offend. My preference is to raise my own children rather than somebody elses. Notice that I used the word "preference" - I have met one woman with young children that I would be glad to be a husband and father to. But I would prefer to find a woman who hasn't had kids and we can have our own and, in theory, live happily ever after (??????). Or at the very least have a couple more that I know will be my direct descendants.

I have had no control of how her kid(s) have been raised. If we were to ever move in together, how would she feel about me treating (eg disciplining) them as if they were my own? This is an area for potential conflict, as I'm sure that I would hear the words "they're not your kids" if she ever disagreed with anything.

Does she genuinely love me and want to be with me, or is part of the reason that she wants a father for her kids? Or maybe a little help in looking after them (financial and/or otherwise)?

Even dating a single person there is a slim chance of anything eventuating. Dating a single mother is even lower beacuse of the above potential complications. Don't make the mistake of lying and turning it into zero chance.

Posted by: spikysparky at August 6, 2008 11:58 PM

One aspect that nobody's mentioned yet (or perhaps my sight is even shorter than usual this evening) - single parents have to be extra-careful about who they allow into their homes because of the tiny chance the date could be a child-abuser. I repeat, it's a tiny chance, but sex abusers can be incredibly devious in their grooming techniques - even in a situation where the targeted child has two parents present.

My ex-husband and his brother - who lived in a trad two-parent family - were both abused for years by a family "friend" who took them on fishing trips and intimidated them into keeping quiet. Result: two damaged men who now have years of broken relationships behind them.

This just shows how much more watchful a single parent has to be - with all the additional pressures of trying to build a relationship, it could be all too easy to push aside your instincts and ignore the signs that something is not right. How many mothers have ignored their own children, or even accused them of lying, because they couldn't bring themselves to believe their husband was an abuser?

Twoeyes, I don't think you're being selfish, just honest about what you want - there are many men who are willing to take on a partner's children and even raise them as their own, but if you know you're not one of them, there's absolutely zero point in pretending you are.

Posted by: missrule at August 6, 2008 9:02 PM

Not mentioning the fact that there are small adults in your profile is bad, but not telling a prospective partner that there are none in you life is a deal breaker for me.

I personally dont want young kids attached to a prospective partner, ...been there done that syndrome.. I would like a person with older children.....say over the age of 18 or even left home. Its not about helping raising a new family from a new partnership, its more about us time.

Thats not to say that others here are the same. I know from my life, as my mother had me when she was 40, that she and my father did it very well, but they had planned to have children when they got together, so along came myself and my twin sister. And I guess thats a different scenario, but similiar.

It may be thought of as selfish but I would like some me time with a new person, not necessarily exclusive, but the thought of young children doesnt do it for me.

Posted by: twoeyes at August 6, 2008 9:25 AM

My son is now 20...but I have put him to the forefront for many years. I still do, in fact, I spoil him rotten. But, I do remember being told that I should 'find someone to look after him' so that I could accept dates..needless to say....I didn't accept the dates. Now we are older, I find myself in the opposite situation.....males around my age (48), have 2nd families and have the responsibilities and commitments that come with that.
It isn't easy, eh?
But, best of luck and happiness to us all.
Cheers,
B.

Posted by: bm1960 at August 5, 2008 8:44 PM

One thing we all seem agreed on as single parents .. Honesty and openness is the only way. Honest and open with your kids that you are dating someone and honesty with your date that you have kids and will in due course introduce them to him once you get to know one another better. Best if you know up front that they may not be interested in dating someone who will often put their childrens needs first .. and see how they react to that!

Posted by: waternymph47 at August 5, 2008 6:48 PM

I had a couple of relationships when my children were small with women who also had kids. It is a bit harder because there are a lot more personalities involved. But with patience it can work out very well.

I have extremely fond memories of outings and week ends away with my 3 and her 4 kids. The kids teamed together remarkably well and looked after themselves.

There is a big downside and that is one develops an affection for your gf's kids and vice versa and when the relationship ends there is a lot more hurt. The children can also be disappointed and hurt.

No easy answer but honesty is as usual a pre-requisite.
rgds grego

Posted by: grego7 at August 5, 2008 3:38 PM

I have had one serious relationship since my divorce.....it took me 8 months before i introduced him to my children...but my children were one of the first things i talked to him about..It was an Easter Lunch,very important in the Greek Orthodox tradition.....mainly as my mother insisted that i bring him along.

It is not an on going thing....my x-husband and I agreed to keep our partners separate from our children.

Posted by: musicteacher at August 5, 2008 3:14 PM

As a single mum to two young children, I feel that it your right to do what you feel is right. I however am an honest person, and my children dont have anyone but me for 99% of the time. Honesty is the best policy, I dont like being lied to, so why would I lie to someone else.

Posted by: shyperthgirl at August 5, 2008 2:10 PM

Interesting reading the comments below. I was shocked & saddened that people would advise prospective partners that they didn't have children, what are they thinking ? I can understand not introducing someone to your kids straight away, it is a big committment, but surely you have to be honest & explain your circumstance. I would be happy to accept what a prospective partner wanted if she had kids. If she wanted to spend time with the kids, that would suit me fine because surely she would be happiest pleasing her children as well as her man.

Posted by: gc323 at August 5, 2008 1:32 PM

Can't imagine anyone denying they have children, after all they are such a huge part of our lives.
Partners and relationships may come and go but once you have a child, you are a mum or dad for life!
I find it very sad that some people view their children as a "mistake" and decide that their own lives and happiness is far more important, than the people that they were responsible for bringing into this world.

I had my last child at 38. I thought about it because I had seen so many women of my age have older children (as I do) and then because they weren't sure of what to do with their lives, have another child (or two) and then decide that wasn't what they wanted after all!
One I knew of, walked out and left her husband with their son in primary school, because she needed to "find" herself.
How sad for that little boy, although his dad proved to be a great single parent.

When I had my last child, my marriage was not stable and truthfully having another child was the last thing we should have been doing!
But we did and in no way do I regret that decision!
However, now I am on my own, I am well aware that a 50 year old woman with a child still in primary school, would not be what most men around my age are looking for!
If they are keen on children they may well be looking for someone who is young enough able to have a baby with them, and those whose children have grown up are looking for someone who has plenty of free time!

Oh well, such is life! I am his mum, and that is the most important thing in the world to me. Even my older children are still a major part of my life.
I imagine it will take a long time (if ever!) before I meet a bloke who is prepared to be with someone of my age, who still has to put her child first.
So I am not holding my breath waiting for "the one" to come along in the near future!

Posted by: amberlight58 at August 5, 2008 11:08 AM

Being a single parent with not a big network of friends and family i don't get the chance to be "single" the kids are always around and if that is the way it is my potential has to be aware that it's the kids and their needs come first. I would love to have the "honeymoon" stage of a new relationship but usually move into the domestic side of things pretty quickly because if they want to see me sometimes the kids have to be involved. I am very careful about who i do date and get involved with before i introduce them to the kids but sometimes it's not as long as i would like.

If someone is serious then theirs or your kids shouldn't be a problem. Honesty is the best way to go.

Posted by: beautiewithin at August 5, 2008 2:49 AM

i have been single for 10 yrs, not with some short relationships in there along the way. My children were 5 & 7 at the start so to me it was more important to be a good mother than find a man. When they were away that was my time to play. Hiding them was never an option, but you can set rules for when they are involved in meeting your "friends".

Making that clear from the start and sticking to it was my success in parenting and relationships/sexlife.

Was unsuccessful in maintaining a permanent relationship but that had nothing to do with my parenting or children. Prob to do with my poor choice in men, or their inability to be brave enough to live life fully and commit to any permanent arrangement.

Life goes on though.. And learning continues.... :)

Posted by: blondeattimes at August 4, 2008 11:14 PM

I think it's vitally important to mention you have kids on your profile. I met a guy who didn't tell me about his kids, when I saw the photo's of them on his bedroom wall he told me they were adopted with his ex-wife. When the truth came out everyone was shocked and appalled. Needless to say his ex-wife won't allow him to have anything to do with them anymore.

Why should they be hidden? They are not something to be ashamed of. I think I would go nuts if that happened again. I have two small children which makes it hard to date because I don't want my date to meet my kids for quite some time, and any sane male would understand and appreciate that. To assist with this, I only date men who have children.

Posted by: qldgirl77 at August 4, 2008 7:45 PM

Having raised 2 kids alone from the ages of 12 & 9 I didn't think of myself as anything but a Mum despite being back on the dating scene again as my kids will always be a part of me. I was only in early 40s then and living in Tasmania and tho I found some prospective employers wanting to discriminate agsainst me because I was a single Mum I still managed to support myself and my 2 kids.
On the dating scene, I all too frequently. had men wanting to move in on me .. despite me making it clear I did not want any man around my kids till I knew and trusted him enough to let him meet them. One even clearly stated that he could see that as I was capable of supporting myself and kids he thought I could support him too! (Fast exit there)
I also found in all too many instances the expectation that sex would happen fairly fast as I'd been married then on my own for a while so must be desperate(fairly gasping for it as one guy said!)
Maybe I just attract losers and b******s but you've got to wonder where I still drag up a modicum of hope after some of the types Ive met. The eternal Optimist ??
Puting myself on RSVP has been a later in life thing since my kids grew up and moved out .. and so far not the place for finding the mature love I hoped for.

Posted by: waternymph47 at August 4, 2008 4:22 PM